I think it is just you an me now ... (archive)

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The pad retainer system is different (spring clip vs retainer pin) and the pistons/seals are different. The Brembo caliper may use the same 44/36mm bores, I'm not sure.

This is NOT true. I have seen, touched and held the same caliper fromt eh movit kit found on the shelves at Brembo that they sell in some kits!

Early Brembo calipers used smaller fasteners holding the caliper halves together but I see from some recent kits (Viper...I don't know about the E39) that they are now using the same 12mm thru-bolts as Porsche. Do you know?

The big advantage of Porsche vs Brembo, in my opinion, is with the rotors. They tend to be much more stable and longer lasting than the Brembo counterparts.

Agree adn disagree. The advantage is that the rotors are cast with the wholes. However, with most brembo kits you can get flat rotors which are better than those with cast holes anyhow.

Also, the rotors from brembo do nto have to be sent to NJ to have them mounted on hats and trued. They can be purchased from MANY locations, which is the big advantage of the Brembo kit IMHO. I have a movit set, and it is a pain to send the hats to NJ to have new rotors put on!

Also, in my experience, the rotors on both kits ont eh same car last approx. the same amoutn of time!

What is it about the caliper that is "not right" for the BMW? I have it on my 540i and it works pretty darned well. I installed a set on my neighbor's 540i and we ran into a shimmy problem. But that turned out to be a bad balance job by someone (using a Hunter GSP 9700!) on a set of wheels that we installed the same day we put the brakes on. A 2nd balance on a Hunter 9000 at High Marques in Morristown, NJ resulted in total elimination of the shimmy. Once again proving that the best equipment doesn't always result in the best job. The human factor remains critical. It also points out that you should only make one change at a time. :-)

IMHO the caliper has too much fluid capacity for most BMW systems. I have already had a master fail on my 540 with stock brakes. The brembo kit is carefully designed to maintain a constand fluid capacity from stock to aftermarket. They have dozens of calipers from which to chooss so as to most closely match the stock system.

This was not a problem with the older cars as most systems were designed with a lot of excess capicity. However, today, most manufacturers are designing systems (such as ABS, MAster and Slave cylinders. etc.) to very precise desing parameters. I am not convinced that taking a caliper with a larger fluid capacity will nto have negative effects on the stock braking systems in the medium to long run. This is nto scientific, just my gut with a little bit of logic and experiencial evidence.

I understand that you put the mov'it kit on your own personal M3. Did you swap it out for the Brembo kit?

Nope, we ran the brembos on the world challenge M3 last year. The car was almost identicle to ours in set-up. Thus we could do side by side and back to back tests.

I really am interested in knowing SPECIFICALLY what the differences are between the Brembo and the mov'it that makes you feel the Brembo is more appropriate. I plan to build a web page with a table of ALL brake options, sources, prices, and advantages/disadvantages. Anything you can provide will be useful.

1. ease of rotor availilty - BREMBO
2. rotors - IMHO it is a tie - BREMBO with solid rotors and MOVIT with cast vented.
3. ease of pad sourcing - MOVIT (slightly better only though)
4. caliper sizing designed to vehicle - BREMBO (I just don't buy the take ONE caliper and make it work everywhere approach)
5. Floating rotors! - BREMBO (with the bearing issue, this is important!)
6. Support - BREMBO (they have numerous support facilities in the US and iot is very easy for anyone to heve any problme dealt with quickly)

I hate to ask the question, but does the Brembo kit have the same, higher, or lower profit margin than the mov'it kit?

slightly higher, I have no problem admitting this. My reputation speaks for itslef. I woudld NEVER push a product only due to profit margins!

It's important for folks to know if any of us have a financial stake in the outcome of any comparison tests. I don't.

I surely do. But I am a long term type of guy. Making more in teh short run on an inferior product will only cost me more in the long run! I want to sell teh kit that will make people the happiest and give them the least problems down the road! The best VALUE!

I'm just asking you so that you can put it out there on the table and then we can either dismiss it as insignificant or we can say that it's significant and then decide individually if we feel the need to factor it in when weighing your advice.

Sure, no worries! Dave, I know you are nto attacking me. We have talked to much and both been here too long for that kind of crap! I fully supprot full disclosure!

In the interest of full disclosure, The Ultimate Garage gave me a discount of a few hundred dollars on my rear brake kit as a thank-you gesture for my putting together the web page of instructions for the front brakes. I didn't know this in advance of my purchase and I'll try not to let it affect my reviews of their products in the future. I do not have any continuing financial arrangements with mov'it or The Ultimate Garage.

Steve is very cool to deal with - no arguement there! Steve has also helped us with a few large project cars such as our project C-Class MB that has been featured in Max Power multiple times!

And I'm an equal opportunity installer of brake kits for free. If you have a Brembo, mov'it, Bear Racing, AP, or any other E39 brake upgrade kit, I'll be happy to install it for you for free on some weekend when I have the time. I've heard that some folks are charging $500 to install a front brake kit! Yikes! My free offer does not extend to the rear brake kit, however. That one's a real bear to put on. I don't even think I would want to do that for a fee.

Like I said, I am nto a fan of any other kit. I really liek both the movit and brembo kits. It took a lto of calculating to determine which we as evosport would push. When it came down to it, the brembo kit simply nudged the movit kits out! I really have nothing bad to say about them or Steve!

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